In the middleAn email conversation with Barrett Bonden regarding President Obama's proposed healthcare reform plan and the misrepresentation in US press of England's National Health Service led to BB's post about the NHS.
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If you wonder what Brits think of their NHS - some of them, at least - visit BB's blog and be sure to read the comments left there. The cartoon above was attached to this article, which you also might find interesting.
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I'm off to do a bit of research of my own, in an effort to get beyond the hysteria and name-calling on both sides of the Congressional aisle, to try to get to the truth.
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Wish me luck; I'm going to need it, I think.
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PS: June Saville, in Australia, addressed this very subject a few weeks ago: check it out here. Also, check Marja-Leena's link, which she left in the comments.
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PPS: Check out the White House link to the Healthcare Reform program here: a very good place to start. Also, for a reality check, visit this White House spot.
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Joe Spado, of Round Circle blog, has this to say. Thank you, Joe.
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(Anyone with factual information, personal experiences with US care or any of the other healthcare systems mentioned, feel free to leave a comment and/or links to reputable sources, honest opinion pieces. Cite your sources so I can check them out. [Hatefulness will be rejected, not that I expect that from anyone here.])
(c)2009 Martha McLemore
20 comments:
You might be interested in reading some of the health care posts on this blog by Americans in Canada: http://wmtc.blogspot.com/search/label/health%20care
I've used the NHS and have had no complaints.
I do think it is a little top-heavy and that some employees are jobsworths but you get that in any large organisation, especially state-run ones.
I've never gone in worried that the service is going to be poor. I go in feeling safe.
Long may that continue.
M-L: Thank you for the pointer. I will read their posts.
:)
John/AWB: Thank you for your response. I'm very interested in all points of view.
:)
Appreciate what you're doing. As I have said I have no desire to edge Americans into anything; they can make up their own minds. I only want to set the record straight about our NHS.
So here's another detail. The UK Conservative party is likely to form our next government, I'm sorry to say. The leader is David Cameron and he had the misfortune to father a son who was brain-damaged or mentally disabled. Both he and his wife lavished endless care on their son who eventually died about six months ago. There was a great deal of justifiable sympathy shown throughout the country, not least from our current Prime Minister, Gordon Brown, who married quite late in life and whose first child died within a day or two of birth. After a decent interval Cameron (an independently wealthy politician) was able to point to the fact that his child had been tended for several years in and out of an NHS hospital and therefore "the NHS is safe with me". Alas, yesterday's papers contained news of a document which hints that the Conservatives may be be considering dismantling the NHS. I find this hard to believe about Cameron (though this doesn't mean I would vote for him) but there are clearly others in his party who are less scrupulous. National healthcare is an expensive business and is an obvious target when costs need to be cut. Ho hum.
BB:
As always, I appreciate and welcome your comments.
Healthcare reform is a thorny issue everywhere. It doesn't help us in the States (or anywhere else for that matter) when the loudest voices are also the false ones.
Thank you, friend, for your input.
:)
Loved the visual--- and as a Canadian I echo your first commenter; our system is not perfect, but my spouse -- who is uninsurable in his US home, is receiving above average health care here, for which I am supremely grateful.
thanks for the concern and the invitations to contribute
Harlequin:
Thank you for your response. Glad to hear/read that your husband is getting good care.
:)
This is a rather difficult argument for me to get into. I am a disabled Veteran and I get health care at any VA hospital at no charge. The health care is okay, but I do have to deal with policy makers that bunch every symptom into one treatment and go from there.
What right do I have to speak up about health care when I have mine? It's like me putting forth dialogue on the abortion issue, I'm a man and I won't ever be pregnant.
On the other hand, that doesn't mean I don't care about health care issues. I'm not saying that because I have mine, I don't care if you have any.
But in my opinion, you will never please everyone. There will be those that bluster that we shouldn't have a national system and vice versa. It will be a hot topic forever. The format of rich versus poor seems to have taken serious root with the Bu$hCo administration, (but it's been arounfd forever), and since they seem to have the money to get their voices heard, there is a frenzy of activity telling us that a national system would be bad. They make up lies and we, in the other camp, find ourselves defending ourselves rather than doing the good thing, that is, caring for all Americans.
Bottom line: the right wing radio and TV personalities that are making this a circus are in the minority, but have the resources, (money), to make it seem that there is a large segment of the population that is against a national plan.
Bring out a plan and vote on it. Like the election in 2008, the results will be the determining factor and I believe we'll see exactly how the people want it to be.
Joe/Spadoman:
Thank you for your perspective, which has value no matter how you receive your healthcare.
:)
There is already some good factual information about the Australian system. I think, from my experience, given the opportunity for fraud, over servicing and costly duplicated administration inherent in any system made up of predominantly a plethora of private medical services I find it puzzling why these aspects don’t seem to figure more in any informed public debate.
It’s difficult to from conclusions from afar but I think the key lies in improved regulation, to ensure a more effective administration of health outcomes and improved efficiencies e.g. – the facility to view a universal database, able to effectively weed out small pockets of extreme over servicing and mitigate against pockets of endemic fraud and or costly duplicated administration. The idea that a government scheme would force existing insurance companies to compete and keep them honest seems to me to be almost irrelevant, just like the raging debates about private enterprise being overshadowed by socialism and so forth. To some extent it doesn’t matter as much as the importance of ensuring good regulation and a safety net to catch everyone.
Ultimately that leads to the conclusion some form of a universal safety net scheme will need to be funded from either taxation or a levy on heath providers. But I also think it advisedly needs to be considered concurrently with improved regulation of your private sector insurance- maybe leading to sensible amalgamation of smaller existing private insurance funds and to ensure a separation between payments for insured heath services for claimants and those who actually perform the services. Certainly that has been my limited experience in Australia dealing with some very large State based schemes here which took over a plethora of private based schemes in workers compensation to yield much lower premiums but improved benefits in subsequent future years. Not easy, but sensible improved regulation for a fairer, more efficient health outcome is indicative of what most countries expect of their elected representatives.
Best wishes
This is one of those subjects that's been very close to the top of my personal lobbying efforts for many years since, as a Canadian, I came to the US and decided to work in health care here. My son was born in Canada and the only sign of payment was the notice about payment having been made to the hospital.
First job here was in RI nearly 30 years ago working for a newly developed HMO that was started by several unions and some sympathetic doctors. We treated many people who'd worked in the New England jewelry industry who'd never had regular medical treatment. Many were discovered to have cancers. Many of them had children who'd never been allowed to play dangerous sports or ride bicycles in case they were hurt. Weird, eh?
Eventually the HMO was bought out by a bigger HMO and that one was swallowed by an even larger one. The days of hostile takeovers began in the 80's and any business was fair prey. I went to work in private practice for a neurologist where a good percentage of our patients had Medicare. People here can make appointments with any specialists they choose so when we'd get calls telling us old uncle Carlo was bumping into walls and falling down a lot we'd routinely tell them to bring all the medication along with their uncle. Sometimes there's be shopping bags full of drugs because the patients had been seeing multiple doctors and filling every prescription written. They'd be subject to so many side effects it was often a wonder to the doctor how they could stand up.
For the past 15 years I've been working principally as a managed care coordinator in a large hospital for various surgical services. If anyone in this country believes they don't have managed care no matter what private insurance they pay for I'd like to have them sit with me for a morning while I make phone calls to the companies. Not only are there hundreds of separate private ones in all 50 - even the largest have different contracts and contract language state by state. I've heard of people with $10k deductibles and $25 or $50k maximum out of pocket expenses that accrue annually. Sad is the situation when somebody gets sick in December and stays that way through January.
Things have become much worse in the past year as more people have lost jobs - including those who used to have customer service jobs at the insurance companies who've been replaced by voice messaging systems. I think the companies find human employees very inefficient especially since they tend to try to be helpful. Yet I also know nurses who have jobs in the insurance industry whose duties are just to scrutinize records to find any loophole that will allow the company to deny a claim.
The general way things happen here when someone gets ill with a life threatening disease, like cancer is that first they're working and have insurance coverage, then they can't work and lose the coverage, then they have to field bills and collection agencies for treatment received while they had no coverage, then, if they're really lucky after losing everything they may just get Medicaid assistance that covers at a rate of about .10 on the dollar.
Hospital expenses are very high because they have to take into account treating people who have no coverage. They do and in many cases are legally bound to do so once the patient has an established relationship. Hospital employees are very kind too in going well out of their way to find assistance for patients. What's cruel about the whole system is the corporate, profit making aspect of the whole thing.
Apologies for a long comment and believe me when I say - I didn't touch even half of it.
Spadoman: The logical starting point for you is, I suppose, to imagine yourself denied vet healthcare. Otherwise what you say seems to confirm the US situation as I read it from the other side of the Pond. However, I am particularly interested to read your opinion about abortion and other matters of healthcare for women. I am always horrified by those men who speak with zealous certainty about these things; in my view men just aren't entitled to lay down the law about childbirth, etc. Unobtrusive background support for the majority of women's interests together with slightly more vocal action on behalf of deserving minorities should be our role. Incidentally, help for wounded servicemen coming home from Afghanistan continues to be a contentious issue over here so I can't pretend we've got that right.
I don't believe your position as a disabled vet should in any way reduce your entitlement to speak out about health. Your disablement didn't arrive as a matter of choice. Bellow all you want. I'm not sure what the majority of cinemagoers were supposed to feel about the central character in "Born on the Fourth of July" but mine was one of great sympathy.
Lindsay, Susan and BB:
Thank you, all, for your responses. Your input is valuable, and sincerely appreciated.
Martha
:)
Great cartoon and thoughtful post. US healthcare sucks. My Dad & Stepmom lost everything after a catastrophic truck wreck (he was burned badly) and their insurance reached its cap. Only in America can the hospital take your home in exchange for treatment. And don't even get me started on what the lack of preventative care does to young families and children.
America SHOULD have single payer system, but I'd settle for the public option. Say NO to co-ops.
I lived a year in Germany and when I came down with chicken pox (at the age of 25) and became VERY ill, I was hospitalized for a week, received very expensive anti-viral treatments, and the cost? Just 5 marks (about $10).
Crow, Here is an e-mail I got from one of the Wisconsin Senators, Herb Kohl. He is a Democrat.
Hello All,
During the month of August, many Senators—including myself—are holding town halls, listening sessions, and meetings in order to hear people’s thoughts on health care reform. I have learned a lot from listening to Wisconsinites all over the state, and I would like to share with you a press release and several press clips about some of the events I’ve held. I always value comments from people here in my home state and I hope you will feel free to contact me with your thoughts as well.
FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE: August 21, 2009
KOHL CONTINUES TOUR OF WISCONSIN TO TALK ABOUT HEALTH CARE REFORM
WASHINGTON – Today U.S. Senator Herb Kohl held a public town hall in Kenosha, the latest in a series of statewide events on health care reform. Kohl has also held events in Superior, Janesville, Eau Claire, Marinette, and LaCrosse where he has heard from smart, thoughtful constituents on all sides of the issue, including consumers, providers, employers, employees, families and senior citizens.
Kohl is reinforcing the need to stay engaged in these discussions into the fall. When Congress reconvenes in September, Kohl hopes to see members returning with a renewed commitment to passing a strong bill. Wisconsin’s senior senator is stressing the importance of expanding access to coverage, one of the most significant aspects of health reform. He is urging the inclusion of provisions to create some sort of public option, to end discrimination of those with pre-existing conditions, and to put a cap on co-pays and other out-of-pocket expenses.
“Having gotten to this point in the debate, we shouldn’t just say ‘let’s settle and move on,’” Kohl says. “We can’t just back away because we fear that we won’t achieve these goals, or because the powerful interest groups and industries win the day against the interests of the people.”
At these events, Kohl focuses heavily on the need to reign in the rising costs of health care, while maintaining and improving health care quality. Kohl is citing statistics that the United States spends $7,290 on health care per person, per year—while the average spent by the 30 most developed countries is $2,960 per person, per year. Despite this discrepancy, studies show that the U.S. ranks below average on major health indicators, including infant mortality and life expectancy, when compared to other industrialized countries.
“We cannot afford to wait another ten or twenty years until health care costs consume an even greater percentage of the economy, not to mention the budgets of small businesses and American families,” Kohl tells his constituents. “It is unacceptable that we have so much more of our money tied up in health care; yet we are not delivering demonstrably better health care than many of these countries.”
Kohl is also setting the record straight by addressing some of the harmful rumors. Kohl, who serves as Chairman of the Senate Special Committee on Aging, has reassured seniors that Medicare will stay intact, that the services they have come to rely on will not change, and that absolutely no one will tell seniors how and when their life will end. Kohl says these blatant distortions are being spread by opponents of health reform in order to weaken support for a strong bill that will protect the rights of health care consumers.
“Kohl says see health care through” – Racine Journal Times
http://www.journaltimes.com/article_d2806734-8df3-11de-97d3-001cc4c002e0.html
“Kohl: Keep improving health care” – Kenosha News
http://www.kenoshanews.com/home/kohl_keep_improving__health_care_6215242.html
“Health Care Reform Debate Hits Superior” – Northland’s News Center
http://www.northlandsnewscenter.com/news/local/53732717.html
Thank you for reading.
Sincerely,
Herb Kohl
Pat/ER:
We are still convinced that the childhood vaccinations my grandson received contributed to (if didn't outright cause) his autism. I understand about the poor care most American children receive. Wouldn't want to be starting a family in this climate today.
:)
Joe/Spadoman:
Thank you so much, friend, for this comment, full of helpful information.
:)
Quite a discussion you've started up here.
I've not much time to launch in; I think I'm happier with the healthcare here than in the UK, for a number of reasons, I think in fact the attitude of healthcare professionals at all levels is actually better, more vocational, conscientious and compassionate, but perhaps that's just based on our perception and experience.
The way of paying for it is different. I'm not sure the British insistence on totally free healthcare at point of demand is always going to be workable. Private insurance here, despite the image of France as very much a welfare state, is very important in many ways, and in our experience provides a good service. But no country can exactly copy another's system like that anyway, because the historical basis for each is going to be different. I wouldn't want to trust such things to British private insurance companies either.
Anyway, anyway... catching up all round. I love coming here to read, can't always think of aposite comments though! Thanks for your visits to mine.
Lucy:
Thank you for your comments. I've had a harder time finding info on France's healthcare system so far, thus appreciate you response.
(PS: it is a joy to visit your blogs, friend.)
:)
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